by Max Barry

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The Gallant Old Republic wrote:I like how people bashed the whole "kiddy table" second debate stages during the Republican debates in 2016 in favor of the 2020 Democratic model of excluding from any stage based on current popularity and name recognition.

I have no idea what you're talking about.

The Catholic State of Eire wrote:Sanders wants to fund abortions in ‘poor countries’ to fight climate change

US presidential candidate Bernie Sanders said he would support using taxpayer money to fund abortions in foreign countries as a means of population control in the face of climate change.

Sanders merged the hot-button issues of climate change and abortion rights, at the same time singling out developing nations as the culprits overpopulating Earth, during a six-and-a-half-hour CNN townhall on climate change on Wednesday. While his supporters appeared galvanized, the proposal invoked the wrath of his detractors online.

https://www.rt.com/usa/468094-sanders-abortions-climate-change/

He has lost me on this one, that somehow free abortions in developing countries are going to save the environment. This is exactly what Pope Francis means when he talks about 'ideological colonisation', Western nations funneling money to impose a culture of relativism, individualism and materialism.

There’s this weird view that consumption is driving climate change. It’s probably not wrong but it really is not that significant. You have to stop the carbon plants.

Post by Furbish islands suppressed by a moderator.

A bit of Pro-Life news from the North of Ireland:

Anti-abortion protest: Crowds march to Stormont in silence

Protesters walked in silence to show their opposition to what organisers described as "the liberalisation of abortion".

Abortion is only available in Northern Ireland in limited circumstances.

In July, legislation was passed to bring NI more into line with the rest of the UK if devolution doesn't return by 21 October.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-49615373

Havilland, Phydios, and S-Hertogenbosch

Phydios wrote:I have no idea what you're talking about.

Allow me to elaborate: in 2016 there were too many Republicans for one stage so they placed the lowest polling candidates on a second stage which some mockingly called the "kiddy table", but they never deplatformed any candidate. This year I saw a number of news outlets saying the Democratic model of 1) pulling names out of a hat to divide between two stages and 2) filtering out candidates based on polling and donor requirements was superior, ignoring the fact that it has deplatformed half of the candidates based on poor polling criteria and current name recognition. In other words I'm saying a kiddy table is better than no table and also more democratic.

Phydios, United massachusetts, and Lagrodia

Post by Furbish islands suppressed by a moderator.

New waldensia wrote:"The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one."

Spock, the logical Vulcan character in Star Trek, used this phrase numerous times throughout the television series. But is it true? Should this maxim guide individuals, should it guide governmental policy?

I was reminded of the phrase when I saw the following post on Facebook from the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum [https://facebook.com/holocaustmuseum/photos/a.423860602676/10156712169337677/]:

“Fathers and mothers, give me your children.” With these words, #OnThisDay in 1942, the Jewish council chairman in the Lodz ghetto asked parents to surrender all children under age ten. He believed that sacrificing those who could not work would save the other ghetto inhabitants. Children, the elderly, and the sick were sent to their deaths at Chelmno killing center to meet a quota of 20,000 set by the Nazis. But about two years later, the Nazis sent all those remaining in the Lodz ghetto, the last large ghetto in German-occupied Poland, to Chelmno and Auschwitz-Birkenau.
http://bit.ly/2lyfZK6GiveMeYourChildren

The Judenrat chairman followed similar logic to Spock. He felt sacrificing "the few" would save "the many". This is illustrated throughout history as well; Lot is an example in the Bible, when he offers his virgin daughters to the Sodomite mob in exchange for them not raping his angelic guest (they refused the alternate victim as the account goes on to tell).

While "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one" might be worthy motivation for the individual, it should not be what government uses as a guideline. Government ought to preserve the rights of the few, or the one, in order to preserve the rights of the many. If the rights of the few are not preserved, then neither will the rights of the many.

Discuss.

Pretty interesting.

A different possible take on this, however, is Utilitarianism, which is just not just trying to benefit the maximum number of people, but rather trying to create the maximum benefit possible.

Thus, while "the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few" might justify carving up 10 children to feed 11 adults, a marginally more nuanced take would realise that the benefit gained by those 11 adults is not worth the loss suffered by those 10 children.

That might seem obvious in this example, but for the Judenrat example you gave above, this was what was lost along the way. This wasn't a morally justifiable stance that was being taken, but rather one that was of some (significant) benefit to those remaining at the time, but was of greater cost to those being sacrificed, even if they were fewer in number.

Of course, utilitarianism can still be immoral. Say we take someone with a million dollars, take away all almost his money (say $900,000), invest it to create wealth, and create $1.1 million of total wealth across a large number of people. Utilitarianism says that's okay, as there's a net gain. However clearly that's not okay - that millionaire had some right to property.
Adjust the numbers of course, and we find there's a grey area. Most (I said most, not all) people believe that generally it's an acceptable and moral thing for governments to collect some sort of tax and spend it for the societal good, and most people believe that the richer you are the more you should proportionally contribute. It's all about where we draw that line.

To my mind, government ought to preserve the rights of the few, but it also needs to preserve the wellbeing of the many. So to my mind, it's right that the government provides a baseline level of welfare to stop the poor starving, and universal healthcare free at the point of delivery to stop the poor suffering needlessly. Likewise, it also needs to protect the safety and freedoms of minority populations (which is why it's NOT okay for China to persecute Uighur Muslim children in the name of national solidarity, for example).

The big thing to me, is that government must represent all the people, not just the majority, but it must always be the will of the people, not an elite that tells people what they need. That's a delicate balance, and is all about judgement.

Is the rights of a few to bear arms worth more than the rights of children not to get shot at school? Is the right of an unborn child to live greater than the right of a woman to bodily autonomy? Okay, that last one may be an easy one for THIS region to answer.

For me, the important thing is to recognise that these are ALL nuanced issues and subject to judgement.

New poll in Zentari, come and vote!

page=poll/p=146842

Solving overpopulation you say, well there’s always the easy solution:
https://youtube.com/watch?v=USADM5Gk9Gs

Post by Furbish islands suppressed by a moderator.

Gad wrote:Greetings all.

Welcome to Right to Life!

https://www.babylonbee.com/news/local-catholic-starting-to-think-church-needs-reformation

Phydios wrote:https://www.babylonbee.com/news/local-catholic-starting-to-think-church-needs-reformation

That is satire, is it not?

Viridus wrote:That is satire, is it not?

Yeah, funnily enough they've had some issues with facebook fact-checking them, despite their open satireness.

Phydios, Viridus, New ephriam, and S-Hertogenbosch

New poll in Zentari, come and vote!

page=poll/p=147102

Hi everyone! So glad to join Right to Life, as it seems like this region is quite a great place. Can't wait to start getting involved!

Post by Furbish islands suppressed by a moderator.

The new united states

Libertatem

https://mises.org/wire/walmarts-healthcare-experiment-has-begun-it-may-be-game-changer

Walmart is experimenting in healthcare by opening up a Walmart clinic in Georgia with completely transparent, low prices.

The evils of capitalism for you.

Upon viewing our embassies, it was discovered that your region is our oldest ally. Many thanks. Please accept this gift:

**Sets up a table of omelets, pancakes, waffles, french toast, syrup, butter, jam, fresh berries, ham, bacon, scrapple, muffins, pastries, coffee, tea, hot chocolate, and Hershey's kisses**

Horatius Cocles, Phydios, and United massachusetts

The new united states wrote:https://mises.org/wire/walmarts-healthcare-experiment-has-begun-it-may-be-game-changer

Walmart is experimenting in healthcare by opening up a Walmart clinic in Georgia with completely transparent, low prices.

The evils of capitalism for you.

This singular action is laudable, however, the generosity of a behemoth corporation is not something I would rely on. This action does not excuse Walmart's anti union, anti labor practices. Nor am I just spouting political talk points, I have the experience of friends that work there.

Walmart was forced to raise its wages to a semi decent level by consistent pressure, not out of some corporate goodwill. The pressure against Walmart workers to not unionize is immense. The sales that customers get come on the back of an exploitive overtime policy and low wages.

This kind of action shouldn't be some kind of outlier of goodness, it should be standard fare esp. From the largest grocery retail in our country.

In short, a good action like this one hardly outweighs the history of bad practices and usually comes about only as a result of sustained pressure by workers or unions or pro worker politicians.

United massachusetts, Clear Bay, and Lagrodia

And did those feet in ancient time,
Walk upon Englands mountains green:
And was the holy Lamb of God,
On England's pleasant pastures seen!

And did the Countenance Divine,
Shine forth upon our clouded hills?
And was Jerusalem builded here,
Among these dark Satanic Mills?

Bring me my Bow of burning gold:
Bring me my Arrows of desire:
Bring me my Spear: O clouds unfold:
Bring me my Chariot of fire!

I will not cease from Mental Fight,
Nor shall my Sword sleep in my hand:
Till we have built Jerusalem,
In England's green & pleasant Land.

The new united states wrote:https://mises.org/wire/walmarts-healthcare-experiment-has-begun-it-may-be-game-changer

Walmart is experimenting in healthcare by opening up a Walmart clinic in Georgia with completely transparent, low prices.

The evils of capitalism for you.

I'm in a weird place right now where I want to complain that the government takes around a 1/4 of my pay. But, I also got a free x-ray, blood test, CT scan, and more on Saturday so I hold my tongue (even if it took me 12 hours to get out of the hospital).

Ps: I'm fine if you're worried, I tore a muscle in my abdomen.

The Catholic State of Eire wrote:A bit of Pro-Life news from the North of Ireland:

Anti-abortion protest: Crowds march to Stormont in silence

Protesters walked in silence to show their opposition to what organisers described as "the liberalisation of abortion".

Abortion is only available in Northern Ireland in limited circumstances.

In July, legislation was passed to bring NI more into line with the rest of the UK if devolution doesn't return by 21 October.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-49615373

Whoa whoa does that mean abortion on demand is coming to NI?

Havilland wrote:Whoa whoa does that mean abortion on demand is coming to NI?

Indeed it does and gay 'marriage' too. The UK Parliament has used the political deadlock that exists here and is now imposing a radical abortion agenda on us.

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