ForestBoard

It's really very simple, my dear. Don't be a fool.

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The wandering elmo wrote:

You are a disgrace to Elmo kind. Please stop making threats and ruining MY repuation along with others. When you said you were working with me. I DONT EVEN KNOW YOU! So please stop making threats please and annoying people please stop.

Thank you for helping to stop spam (now I get what the other Forestians mean by spam), but in the future, it’s probably best to just ignore them and/or ask someone who is able to suppress the comment. Turbeaux and Verdant Haven both have that power, and so do others I think. If we just ignore them, hopefully our normal discussion will engulf the RMB until spam will be buried behind a stream of meaningful discourse. I learnt this the hard way yesterday, but now I fully understand what is acceptable and what isn’t, and I will not be doing spam anymore.

Edit: I see that a few Forestians (Forestians? Foresters? Trees? What’s our demonym?) have changed their flags, notably Ruinenlustand Kawastyselir. Nice new flags!

Uan aa Boa wrote:

While this is certainly true, every officer who has picked up a batton, a riot shield or a tear gas canister is in my view an accessory to and an enabler of racism. There are personal choices here and the "just doing my job" defence was dealt with at Nuremberg. Yes, the officers involved have kids to feed and bills to pay and this constrains them. These are the good intentions with which the road to hell is paved. When peaceful protestors are being tear gassed to clear the way for a presidential photo opportunity the police are not neutral arbiters or protectors of the people, they are oppressors who have failed the moral challenge to say "I won't do this."

As you said above, however, they may need to feed their families, or else they may have other reasons. My point is, once you actually understanding their view and their choices, then we can say whatever we’d like to then. My problem is that everyone’s been making blanket statements, when in reality, they all have different reasons (or lack thereof), and so by saying, “oh, I hate you protestors” or “I hate you police”, you are simply inspiring more hate while solving nothing. Don’t get me wrong, Uan aa Boa, I am not accusing anyone here of this, but I am fed up with the portrayal of this. Not all protestors are burning police cars in the streets, and likewise not all policemen are corrupt racists. But when we portray this as such, we are simply spreading hatred blindly.

I agree that simply saying “It’s my job” is not enough for the police, but by claiming that that is the mentality of the police is false, as not all police are like this. Same thing with Trump and others, claiming that the protestors have gone too far, when most of them are just protesting peacefully and calmly. When either side brings violence and hatred to the table, they are causing harm, as you do not know the other person’s thought process. When they’re burning things or throwing Molotovs at police simply because they are police, or when the police spread tear gas and shoot rubber bullets at a crowd simply for practicing civil disobedience, they are simply spreading violence and hatred, without ever fully understanding the views of the individual humans whom they are attacking.

To me, it’s perfectly fine for you to feel that all policemen who try to stop the protestors are keeping the racism in our country. However, what we can’t be doing is be spreading violence, nor should we be making blanket statements. We should go on a case by case basis, and we never should let our views lead us to stooping to the level of the racists. This is ever as much a propaganda war as it is a street war, and when you just make blanket statements or use violent tactics, it’s simply hurting the cause of equality and justice, which can and does exist within the hearts of people on both sides.

Ruinenlust wrote:

Thank you Middle Barael, but all credit for the pride edition of the Ruinenlustian flag goes to The Riparian Procyonid Republic of Raccoon Creek, who graciously offered to modify my then-flag, which was black where the rainbow is on this edition (with just the thin light blue lines remaining). Then, after the summer, I myself [took great pains to figure out a MacBook equivalent of Microsoft Paint, and eventually] designed the yellow and purple one themed one that I've had recently.

Perhaps I repaid Raccoon Creek with the "riparian procyonid" category suggestion, though, because they are still using it! :-)

I'm actually surprised you are still using the flag; I feel honored.

Gotta say, I do love the pre-title. It has stuck with me for a year now.

Turbeaux wrote:

I prefer Foresters because "Forester" is a dictionary word with definitions that definitely apply to residents of Forest (see https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/forester ). Also, Forestian looks and sounds clunky to me. "Trees" is good too. However, there are no rules or guidelines in place so use whichever term you like.

Ah, it's time for the demonym discussion again.

My favourite has always been "Forest denizens", just because "denizens" is such a fun word and it reminds me of little forest sprites or something. But I tend to use "Forestians" because it's generally understandable, even though it's a bit clunky, whereas "Foresters" could be misinterpreted as an referring to people in charge of forest management. I'd feel much more comfortable calling Verdant Haven our regional Forester than I would calling all of us Foresters. :)

Middle Barael wrote:

As you said above, however, they may need to feed their families, or else they may have other reasons. My point is, once you actually understanding their view and their choices, then we can say whatever we’d like to then. My problem is that everyone’s been making blanket statements, when in reality, they all have different reasons (or lack thereof), and so by saying, “oh, I hate you protestors” or “I hate you police”, you are simply inspiring more hate while solving nothing. Don’t get me wrong, Uan aa Boa, I am not accusing anyone here of this, but I am fed up with the portrayal of this. Not all protestors are burning police cars in the streets, and likewise not all policemen are corrupt racists. But when we portray this as such, we are simply spreading hatred blindly.

I do agree to the extent that I dislike the "ACAB" slogan. It feels like it's needlessly simplifying an issue in a way that helps nobody.

Not all police are bad. But they're working in a police system that is completely rotten -- a system which teaches them to wear military gear and act like a paramilitary. A system which teaches them that they are the "thin blue line" who need to "dominate" any perceived slight on their authority, even when there's no risk to themselves or anyone else. The police are, largely, over-equipped but under-trained and under-paid middle-class Americans who very often see nothing of themselves reflected in the communities they have to work in (communities which, reasonably, feel nothing but hostility for them), and are told by their culture that the only way to gain respect is by tolerating no insult and showing no hesitation to use violent force.

Ruinenlust wrote:

Northern Wood made a wonderfully poignant post about the riots and violence enveloping the country, and I had typed two paragraphs in response, and then deleted it because it was already like 40 posts ago. The gist of it was about the dichotomy between the peacefulness and tranquility of my own days gardening and enjoying the woods and the overlapping and multifaceted problems facing the country on the other hand.

That's alright, but thanks for the recognition.

Yes, it is times like this that I begin to question my choice to live in big cities... Sometimes it is indeed tempting to retreat into the woods, or at least the country, and leave the city behind...

...but then, I think I would find life a bit dull. Though an inveterate introvert, I like to have the hustle and bustle going on around me, even when I choose to shut the door to it all and sit alone in my apartment.

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In Philly news: I'm just so tired of seeing ever-more police brutality during a protest in response to an act of police brutality. How can folks be so clueless, so tone deaf, and so heartless? How on earth could every single police officer not come away from watching a video of their colleague slowly choke the life out of an innocent man while he begs and pleads for his life, and not think that there needs to be drastic changes to their profession?

Local hiring for police forces, only, no exceptions. If you want to move out of the city, you no longer get to police that community that you will be rapidly losing touch with. Get rid of all of their toys, strip back all of that funding for militarization that came after 9/11, and drastically refocus their role into community policing. And dismantle the laws that are shielding them from being prosecuted for all of these murders.

I'm tired of this.

Mount Seymour wrote:

I do agree to the extent that I dislike the "ACAB" slogan. It feels like it's needlessly simplifying an issue in a way that helps nobody.

Not all police are bad. But they're working in a police system that is completely rotten -- a system which teaches them to wear military gear and act like a paramilitary. A system which teaches them that they are the "thin blue line" who need to "dominate" any perceived slight on their authority, even when there's no risk to themselves or anyone else. The police are, largely, over-equipped but under-trained and under-paid middle-class Americans who very often see nothing of themselves reflected in the communities they have to work in (communities which, reasonably, feel nothing but hostility for them), and are told by their culture that the only way to gain respect is by tolerating no insult and showing no hesitation to use violent force.

The problem is in the system, I agree, and so rather than blindly fighting all cops or all protestors, we need to renounce violence and come to understand that a) all police and all protestors are different, and that b) violence won’t work, and c) that it is most productive for both sides to put down their weapons and start working, through activism or through politics or simply through showing solidarity, towards a more just society. The protestors may be right in my opinion, but both sides have people who are wrong, because they use violence. The police are not for a corrupt unjust system, they are trapped by it, except rather than being attacked by it, they are stuck in that their industry and their mentality and their society and their community is entangled with racism. There are plenty of cops who want to change this, but they too are trapped by it, and so only by working together can we make progress.

My view on Justice is that it means “every gets an equal right and an equal opportunity towards a good future”. This means that we all should, in a just society, which America right now is not, everyone gets the same right to a good future, white or black, protestors or police. But it is our individual actions and morals that ultimately make it come true, for we are given an equal right and an equal opportunity, but it is your fault if you throw it away.

Raccoon Creek wrote:

Oh and I wouldn't be doing my job if I didn't say "close all the unnecessary embassies." ;-)

We have been discussing this, so don’t worry. In the mean time, however, it’ll be great if you all sign up to be ambassadors for the regions that do not have ambassadors. Also, for those who already are or are listed as ambassadors, we will soon be following up with you, or if you’d like to make our job a bit easier, you can simply quote this and tell us where you are “stationed” and whether or not you’d like to continue.

Turbeaux wrote:

Regarding denoyms, fair enough. I like "Trees" if VH (and/or other ROs) are the only "Foresters." I like the concept of all of our denizens (except the blatant trolls) being "Foresters" because it is an indicator of egalitarianism. One of my greatest regrets about my turn at the FK spot was largely failing to deliver my concept of doing more to involve non-RO denizens in regional government.

I agree that "ACAB" is inaccurate but people love simplistic acronyms. I propose "MCSAC" (Many Cop Shops Are Corrupt) but I am a cisgendered white male who has largely avoided police oppression (I got CP gassed at an anti-war protest once but that was intended to deal with some agent provocateurs right next to me. Still, not good to use somewhat indiscriminate force to deal with a few bad apples within a peaceful bunch.) due to these traits putting me in a privileged group (unfairly of course). When considering the current climate, it is important to remember that many people have already been pushed to the edge by pandemic-related economic stress.

Two comments. Firstly, I agree with you that it is more egalitarian if we all mostly have the same demonym, so maybe we’re all Trees or Forestians, but Errinundera, Verdant Haven, and maybe Ransium are Foresters?

Secondly, what is PC? Also, good point about white privilege. I too have avoided the subject compared to other social justice issues like climate change, partially probably due to white privilege, and also due to the fact that I always cared more about climate change, gun reform, LGBTQ gets, foreign policy, and now more recently, healthcare, income inequality, proportional representation, multi-party statehood (like more than two parties, we need a system that is like a parliamentary system but without the whole prime-minister-comes-from-the-most-seats-as-opposed-to-most-literal-votes thing), and social democracy.

I know my flag was basically a pride variant already, but take my slightly altered flag for June. I used the seven colour variant of the pride flag for convenience.

Middle Barael wrote:

Yes, although our justice system should aim at rehabilitating spammers and teaching them not to spam, and also restorative justice, or fixing the problems caused, meaning self-deleting posts and doin some sort of “community service” for forest. We should not punish to hardly

It's not justice, it is housekeeping. Sure, rehabilitation is the goal here, until you get folk like Elmo, who ignore efforts to rehabilitate. At this point the Forest Warden steps in.